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The ICAO FRMS Symposium
DAY 1: Tuesday, 30 August 2011 - Morning
OPENING Moderator: Ms. Nancy Graham, Director, Air Navigation Bureau, ICAO |
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9:00 – 9:15 |
Opening and Welcome Remarks |
Mr. Roberto Kobeh, President of Council, ICAO. |
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9:15 – 9:45 |
Why we Need to Improve the Way we Manage Fatigue – The Global Perspective |
Keynote Speaker: Mr. Randy Babbitt, FAA Administrator |
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9:45 – 9:50 |
Lead in to Conference Sessions |
Nancy Graham, ICAO |
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SESSION 1 – Is FRMS the Answer to All Our Fatigue Problems? Moderator: Ms. Nancy Graham, Director, Air Navigation Bureau, ICAO |
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9:50 – 10:20
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The FRMS Journey: From its Beginnings to ICAO Standards
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Dr. Curt Graeber Leader of ICAO's FRMS Task Force
Flight sponsored by: National Airlines Council of Canada
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10:20 – 10:30 |
Questions to Dr. Graeber and Summary |
Ms. Nancy Graham, Director ANB, ICAO |
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10:30 - 11:00 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by the Air Canada Pilots Association (ACPA) |

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SESSION 2 – FRMS SARPS – the Conceptual Framework Moderator: Mr. Mervyn Fernando, President of the ANC, ICAO |
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11:00 – 11:10 |
Introduction: Why do we need FRMS Standards and Recommended Practices?
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Mr. Mervyn Fernando, President ANC, ICAO
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11:10 – 11:25 |
The Structure and Content of the FRMS Provisions
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Dr. Michelle Millar FRMS Project Coordinator, ICAO
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11:25 - 11:40 |
The SMS & FRMS Relationship: Natural Bedfellows or Do They Both Have to Grow Up First? |
Capt. John Illson, Chief, ISM Section, ICAO |
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11:40 – 12:00 |
Lounge Interview: FRMS Guidance for Regulators and Operators
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Interviewees:
- Mr. Guenther Matschnigg, VP, IATA - Ms. Nancy Graham, Director ANB, ICAO - Capt. Don Wykoff, President, IFALPA |
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12:00 – 13:30 |
Lunch |
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DAY 1: Tuesday, 30 August 2011 - Afternoon
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SESSION 3 – The Science Behind FRMS Moderator: Capt. Jim Mangie, Pilot Fatigue Program Director, Delta Air Lines |
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13:30 – 13:40
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Introduction: Using Science to Guide Us |
Capt. Jim Mangie, Delta Air Lines |
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13:40 - 13:55 |
The Causes of Fatigue
- Sleep Loss
- Circadian Factors
- The "Perfect Roster"
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Prof. Philippe Cabon, Paris Descartes University, France
Flight sponsored by: National Airlines Council of Canada
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13:55 – 14:10 |
Measuring Fatigue (Including Bio-Mathematical Models) |
Dr. Greg Belenky, Washington State University, U.S.
Flight sponsored by: National Airlines Council of Canada
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14:10 – 14:25 |
Science in an Operational Setting |
Prof. Philippa Gander, Massey University, New Zealand
Flight sponsored by: Delta Air Lines
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14:25 - 15:00 |
Lounge Interview: Learning to Talk to Scientists
- Where are the gaps?
- Subject Matter Experts vs. Scientists
- Asking scientists operational questions
- What science do the mathematical models reflect?
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Interviewees:
- Prof. Philippe Cabon - Dr. Greg Belenky - Prof. Philippa Gander |
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15:00 – 15:30 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by the Fatigue Risk Management Science Limited
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SESSION 4 – Building and Maintaining Trust Moderator: Ms. Michelle Millar, FRMS Project Coordinator, ICAO |
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15:30 – 16:30 |
Lounge Interview:
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Effective safety reporting systems
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Safety vs. labour negotiations
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Personal responsibility and fitness for duty
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The role of the DME in FRMS
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Sleep disorders and medicals
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The use of hypnotics
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Sharing and protecting data (government, the regulator, the operator) |
Interviewees:
- Capt. Don Wykoff, President, IFALPA - Dr. Tony Evans, Chief Aviation Med. Section, ICAO - Mr. Bill Voss, CEO, FSF - Prof. Philippa Gander, Director, Sleep/Wake Research Centre |
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16:30 |
Cocktail Reception Hosted by the International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) |
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DAY 2: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 - Morning
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SESSION 5 – FRMS Regulatory Challenges Moderator: Mr. Mike Comber, Director ICAO Relations, IATA |
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9:00 – 9:10
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Introduction |
Mr. Mike Comber, IATA
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9:10 – 9:30 |
The Problem with Operators
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Wing Commander Ben Cook, Australian Defence Force |
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9:30 – 9:50
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Continuous Monitoring and Oversight of States with FRMS Regulations |
Mr. Henry Gourdji, Chief, CMO Section, ICAO |
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9:50 - 10:10 |
Can Regulators be Confident that an FRMS Provide an Acceptable Level of Safety?
- Aesthetics vs. Substance
- Performance Indicators
- When to say "No"
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Ms. Kathryn Jones, Manager, Operational Regulation, UK CAA |
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10:10 - 10:30 |
Experiences on the Road to FRMS Regulation |
Mr. Daniel Coutelier, Rulemaking Officer, EASA |
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10:30 - 10:45 |
Question and Answer
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Interviewees:
- Mr. Ben Cook - Mr. Henry Gourdji - Ms. Kathryn Jones - Mr. Daniel Coutelier |
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10:45 – 11:15 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by AD-OPT, A Kronos Division
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SESSION 6 – What do the FRMS SARPS Mean for States? Moderator: Mr. Jim Dow, Air Navigation Commissioner, Canada |
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11:15 – 12:00 |
Lounge Interview: Standards for FRMS ask States to advance further in the direction of performance-based regulation.
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What are the challenges for regulators in developing such regulations?
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What difficulties can be anticipated when implementing them?
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What can and should be done to ensure consistency when they are being interpreted and applied?
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How can states know that they are working? |
Interviewees:
- Ms. Nicole Girard Director, Policy and Regulatory Services, Transport Canada - Ms. Izabela Tissot Antunes Sampaio, Civil Aviation Regulation Specialist, ANAC - Ms. Kathryn Jones, Manager, Operational Regulation, UK CAA - Mr. John Duncan, Manager, Flight Standards, FAA |
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12:00 - 13:30 |
Lunch |
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DAY 2: Wednesday, 31 August 2011 - Afternoon
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SESSION 7 – FRMS Challenges for the Operator Moderator: Capt. Paul McCarthy, Observer to the ANC, IFALPA |
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13:30 – 13:50 |
The Problem with Regulators
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- Ms. Nancy Rockbrune Assistant Director, SMS, IATA - Capt. Michel Chiasson, National Airlines Council of Canada
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13:50 – 14:05 |
Operators Large and Small - Is FRMS for Everybody?
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Dr. Alexandra Holmes, Cranfield University
Flight sponsored by: National Airlines Council of Canada
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14:05 – 14:20 |
What about the Cabin Crew?
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Ms. Candace Kolander, International Transport Workers' Federation |
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14:30 – 15:00 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by InterDynamics |
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SESSION 8 – The Difficult Questions Interviewer: Bill Voss, CFO Flight Safety Foundation |
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15:00 – 15:45 |
Panel Interview
Bill Voss, Interviewer, will pose some of the more controversial and complex questions to our panel of experts, including:
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Arguing safety but thinking efficiency
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The issue of commuting
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Controlled rest in the flight deck
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Why has ICAO only focused on flight and cabin crew?
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Is FRMS for everyone? |
Interviewees:
- Ms. Kathryn Jones - Capt. Don Wykoff - Capt. Jim Mangie - Dr. Michelle Millar - Dr. Curt Graeber |
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15:45 – 16:15 |
The Future - What can we Expect from FRMS?
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Dr. Mark Rosekind Member, NTSB
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16:15 – 16:30 |
Closure of the FRMS Symposium
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Ms. Nancy Graham, Director ANB, ICAO
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FRMS Forum's Third Annual Meeting
DAY 3: Thursday, 1 September 2011
1st September 2011 |
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8:30 - 8:35 |
Welcome and Housekeeping |
Mr. Douglas Mellor, FRMS Forum
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8:35 - 8:50
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Introduction
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Dr. Curt Graeber, Chair, FRMS Forum
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8:50 - 9:05 |
Addressing the myths about bio-mathematical models |
Capt. Jim Mangie, Delta Air Lines |
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9:05 - 10:20 |
Model Review 1
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Mr. Len Pearson, Interdynamics Pty Ltd. Mr. Richard Yates, Integrated Safety Support |
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10:20 - 10:50 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by Integrated Safety Support (ISS)
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10:50 - 11:20 |
Setting up a new operational network around FRMS |
Capt. Simon Stewart, NAS Air |
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11:20 - 12:35 |
Model Review 2
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Dr. Steve Hursh, Institutes for Behavior Resources, Inc. |
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12:35 - 14:00 |
Lunch |
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14:00 - 15:15 |
Model Review 3
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Mick Spencer Dr. Barbara Stone, FRMSc Limited |
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15:15 - 15:45 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by the Aloft Group and Integrated Safety Support (ISS) |

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15:45 - 17:15 |
Lessons learned when Implementing FRMS
- NetJets Europe, Portugal
- German Wings
- National Airlines Council of Canada (NACC)
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Mr. Douglas Mellor, FRMS Forum
- Ms. Claudia Cabaco, Netjets Europe
- Capt. Kristjof Tritschler,
German Wings
- Capt. Michel Chiasson, Chair, NACC
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17:15 |
Close |
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19:00 |
Cocktails - Delta Hotel Sponsored by CAA International |

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20:00
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Dinner Reception - Delta Hotel
Participants planning to attend this reception must register at the FRMS Forum website by clicking here |
At individual's personal cost of $88 CAD per head |
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DAY 4: Friday, 2 September 2011
2nd September 2011 |
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8:30 - 9:45 |
Model Review 4
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Dr. Martin Moore-Ede, Circadian Technology
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9:45 - 10:00
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Fatigue Reporting Forms and the role of the Fatigue Safety Action Group |
Dr. David Powell, Air New Zealand
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10:00 - 10:30 |
Coffee / Refreshments Sponsored by Interdynamics Pty Ltd.
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10:30 - 11:45 |
Model Review 5
- The Boeing Alertness Model
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Mr. Tomas Klemets, Jeppesen |
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11:45 - 12:05
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Separating Industry Issues from Safety Issues |
Capt. Rob Holliday, Virgin Atlantic |
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12:05 - 12:20 |
FAA Approach |
Dr. Tom Nesthus, FAA Mr. Dale Robers, FAA |
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12:20 - 13:45 |
Lunch |
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13:45 - 14:25 |
Summary of the Models
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Ms. Kathryn Jones, UK CAA and Presenters |
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14:25 - 14:55
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Validating models within an operational environment
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Ms. Lydia Hambour, easyJet
Dr. Arnab Majumbar, Imperial College, London |
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14:55 - 15:25 |
The "Fit to Fly" Approach |
Dr. Reis Simons, TNO |
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15:25
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Closing Remarks |
Dr. Curt Graeber, Chair, FRMS Forum |
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